Rembrandt Casino neglectis gambling issue (3500 Euro involved)

UNRESOLVED
marko Germany
posted on November 10, 2013.

Hello,

I am new to AskGamblers and subscribed to this forum, because I believe that an online casino ripped me off.

On September 6th, 2013, I had informed Rembrandt Casino that I want my account to be closed due to a gambling problem. One month later I received their promotional emails again. I started depositing and playing again and lost 3500 Euro since then.

I asked Rembrandt Casino to refund my losses, because they have been aware of my gambling problem. But the casino claims, that they had reopened my account, because I had not replied to an email sent 30 days after September 6th, in which I was asked whether my account shall remain closed. The casino claims, that I should have confirmed my account closure 30 days after I had informed them of my gambling problem!

I believe that this kind of behaviour violates common rules of Responsible Gaming. The account of a player, who had admitted a gambling problem, should not be automatically reopened one month later, if he does not reply to any emails. A problem gambler does not want to communicate with casinos anymore. Just for comparison: An alocoholic is not asked every 30 days, whether he is really sure that he wants no alcohol anymore.

I can provide copies of my emails and of a chat, in which I was told that my email from September 6th, 2013, had been received and had been read.

I kindly ask AskGamblers to advise me how to proceed. Rembrandt Casino is licensed in Puerto Rico, but so far I have no address of the licensor, which I can contact.

Thank you

marko

posted on November 13, 2013.

Marco had his account closed the same day support has received his email. As no time period had been mentioned in his email regarding his account closure period, he has received a promotional email early October informing him that his account freezing period was over and his account has been re-opened. Since than, he has often been communication with live chat and support requesting special bonuses and promotions, without mentioning gambling problems. These were also not visible from his gambling patterns.

The management takes gambling issues of players very seriously, closes player accounts permanently on request and guide them towards institutions who could help players with gambling issues.

marko Germany
posted on November 13, 2013.

On September 6th I had sent an email to Rembrandt Casino requesting an account lock due to a gambling problem. I can prove it, because I still have a copy of this email. It is a common procedure, that a player's account must be locked for at least 6 MONTHS, once a gambling problem has been mentioned.

The casino claims that it takes gambling issues very seriously, but in my case it did NOT! Instead, the casino sent me an email 30 days later telling me that my account has been re-opened. I had NEVER asked them to do so. Here is my comparison again: Would you offer an alcoholic a bottle of wine just 30 days after he told you, that he wants to quit drinking alcohol?

I request a refund of all deposits that I made since September 6th (total: 3500 Euro), when I mentioned my gambling problem. I am NOT asking the casino to refund the deposits that I made before that date.

If Rembrandt Casino continues to turn down my request, I kindly ask the staff of Askgamblers to step in. Also, I would then like to contact the licensor of Rembrandt Casino in Puerto Rico to look into this case and (if necessary) take away the casino's license.

marko

posted on November 14, 2013.

Marko did send us an email on which we responded in a timely manner. We replied to him that his account was set to FREEZE. Freeze is a different account status than a closure. Marko told us he is aware of the difference. He did not ask for a permanent closure of his acount. 30 days later he received an auto email that his FREEZE period was over. Marko did not object to it.

Marko contacted us on:

4/11 ( 2 times)

2/11 ( 3 times

1/11 ( 4 times)

31/10: (4 times)

80 % of his contact were made on live chat. He never mentioned he had issues with gambling addiction. In one of the last emails, we offered Marko to set up a contact with counselors who are specialized in gambling addiction. We offered Marko as well to discuss the situation with him by phone. He declined.

All this taken into consideration, and of course we understand that Marko is annoyed by his loss, can not lead to the fact that he is entitled for a refund. We have had clear communications, and even if we misinterpreted his email, there were lots of contact moments on which he could have respond on which he did not. We do follow our players wishes but a refund would disadvantage players who may have lost as well. The communication Marko send to us was also mentioning threads to our brand.

If his gambling addiction is so strong than we will find him the right help.


Responsible gaming requires both the operators and the players to follow established procedures.

marko Germany
posted on November 14, 2013.

Rembrandt Casino misses the point of my complaint and downplays the seriousness of this issue. Here are the facts, which I can prove with saved emails and chat logs:

On September 6th I had asked the casino to close my account due to a gambling problem. I did NOT ask for a freeze. I asked for an account closure! I did not even know, what a "freeze" is. I never told Rembrandt Casino, that I was aware of the difference, neither by chat nor by email. Rembrandt Casino is lying, when it says otherwise.

If I admit a gambling problem and ask for an account closure, then I do NOT want the casino to reopen my account WITHOUT MY CONSENT. I never asked the casino to reopen my account! The casino simply informed me 30 days later, that my account has been reopened, although I had never asked for it!

If I go to my bank and close my bank account, then the bank would not tell me 30 days later, that my account has been reopened again without my consent!

It is true that I did not mention my gambling problem again, AFTER my account had been reopened. The reason is simple: The casino had flooded me with promotional offers by email, and I was seduced to play again. But I do have the copy of a chat, which proves that the casino had read my email from September 6th, in which I had admitted my gambling problem. And that is sufficient evidence.

The casino should have waited for my consent to reopen the account, because I had already admitted a gambling problem. In this case any fair jurisdiction will judge in favor of the player.

Rembrandt Casino violates common practices of responsible gambling. I request the refund of 3500 Euro, which I had deposited since September 6th. And since Rembrandt Casino does not even seem to comprehend the seriousness of this issue, I also request a thorough investigation regarding its license.

marko

marko Germany
posted on November 15, 2013.

I cannot believe it: I just received the 2nd promotional offer from Rembrandt Casino this week, although they must be aware of my gambling problem now. I received a promotional email on Tuesday, and now a second one today with bonuses for the "wee-kend". Is that how a professional care for problem gamblers looks like???

Rembrandt Casino says that "a refund would disadvantage players who may have lost as well." I doubt that all those players admitted a gambling problem, before they lost their funds. And that is the point: I requested an account closure due to a gambling problem. There is nothing to misinterpret such a request!!!

It is that simple: I had asked for self-exclusion due to a gambling problem, and the casino neglected that request and reopened my account just 30 days later without my consent. That is why I want my 3500 Euros back.

marko

posted on November 18, 2013.

Marko,


Your account is closed. You can confirm that I assume. Your account has been closed, and we had not taken you of the mailing list.


This is our mistake and we apologize for the inconvenience. You can also use the unsubscribe link in the mailer, but we have taken care of it as well. Nevertheless you could not have used the promotion as your account is closed.


Marko, please let us know if you need professional help with reference to your gambling addiction. We can get you in contact with specialized counselors.


We are happy to hear from you,

marko Germany
posted on November 18, 2013.

Thank you for offering help regarding my gambling problem. I meanwhile get professional help from a trained therapist.

However, that does not change anything regarding my complaint. On September 6th I had requested an account lock due to a gambling problem, and I have a copy of a chat which proves that you had read my request. You misinterpreted my request and reopened my account 30 days later without receiving my consent.

You CANNOT expect from an addicted gambler that he will repeat his request again and again. As a matter of fact, problem gamblers often change their mind and suddenly want to play again. To make sure that this will not happen, I had asked you to close my account. I never asked you to reopen it. Also, I never asked you to reopen it automatically, if I do not reply to any of your emails.

The message of my email from September 6th is clear enough:

"Please close my account.

I have a gambling problem."

I don't see, how such a clear statement can be misinterpreted.

Refunding my 3500 Euro will not disadvantage any other players, because I am sure that they have not requested such an account closure.

marko

posted on November 19, 2013.

Marko, we are glad you found help.

Is this the first time you are getting help for your addiction?

Did you register at our website despite your already developed addiction?

We are on both sides repeating our opinions. We feel sorry for your loss and understand that it can be upsetting. But loosing and winning is part of the game.

We are also sorry to learn now that you feel you are mistreated. But we take responsible gaming and your issue very seriously, and there for we also kept on replying, but we must come to an end.

During your freeze, at the moment you received our freeze notification, at the moment your account freeze expired, at all the moments you had direct contacts with our support team, and later as well, you have had many chances. The lack of response than can not being taken out of consideration. Responsible gaming can not come solely from operators side.

Marko, if we can refer you in the future to a next step of help, or if we can do something for the future, you may always contact us.

marko Germany
posted on November 20, 2013.

I have 2 proofs. One is the email which I sent on September 6th, in which I had requested an account closre due to a gambling problem.

The other is a copy of a chat from November 8th. In that chat, Henry (the casino chat operator) confirmed that my email from September 6th had been read.

I wish to upload both documents, so that everyone can view them, but I cannot find un upload button here. How can I upload documents at askgamblers.com ?

marko

AskGamblers
posted on November 21, 2013.

Marko, you may send me these screenshots to [email protected] and I'll attached them to the complaint or you may upload them on some free server and post the links here.

marko Germany
posted on November 21, 2013.

Rembrandt Casino speaks with two tongues, when advising me to seek professional help and when at the same time ignoring my rights. I already get professional help for my gambling problem and I have been informed about my rights. These rights are clear: A casino MUST NOT reopen the account of a player who admitted a gambling problem, unless he asks the casino to do so or unless he had asked for a temporary closure only. I had not asked for a temporary closure. I had asked the casino to lock my account due to a gambling problem. And I never asked the casino to reopen it again! That’s it. Any judge will vote in my favor.

I agree that responsible gaming requires responsibilities from BOTH player and operator. That is why I took responsibility when requesting my account to be locked due to a gambling problem. It is very hard for an addicted gambler to admit his gambling problem. I did so on September 6th, and I have proof that Rebrandt Casino had read my request.

So I did take care of my responsibilty. But what about the responsility of the casino??? The casino reopened my account after 30 days WITHOUT WAITING for my consent. The casino could have asked me whether I would like to reopen my account. THEY DID NOT!!! The casino could have asked me whether I have overcome my gambling problem. AGAIN THEY DID NOT!!! The casino simply reopened my account automatically. So the casino did not accept any responsibilty for a problem gambler like me. And, I repeat myself, I do have the screenshot of a chat which proves that the casino was aware of my gambling problem. I will Askgamblers to post it here.

I offer Rembrandt Casino another 7 days to refund the 3500 Euro, which I deposited since admitting my gambling problem. If the casino fails to do so, I will take this issue to a much broader forum at Casinomeister, and I will also contact its licensor in Puerto Rico. A casino, which is not willing to learn about responsible gaming, must lose its license.

marko

AskGamblers
posted on November 21, 2013.

Here's the link to a screenshot, provided by the player - http:/­/im­age­sha­ck.u­s/­a/i­mg8­37/­167­1/x­o7b.jpg


By the way, Marko, we are not expecting anything in return of giving you the chance to seek for your rights using our mediatory service, but hey! Show some respect at least! You are totally free to go to the aforementioned "much broader forum" whenever you wish, just stop wasting our time and that's it! But if you decide to stay here and fight for your rights, then you'd better change your language a bit and start respecting what we are trying to do here!

marko Germany
posted on November 22, 2013.

I am sorry about my language. It is not my native language, and I surely did not want to hurt anyone. It's just that I already had several communications with Rembrandt Casino, but the casino always says that they care for responsible gaming and that they wish to close this issue. What can I do?

I would like Askgamblers to step in and negotiate in this issue. It doesn't have to be another forum. I trust that Askgamblers is the right place to solve the issue. I just want Rembrandt Casino to know that I will never give up, because I learnt from my therapist that the casino was doing me wrong. An addicted player CANNOT quit gambling, if a casino reopens his account WITHOUT his consent!

The account of a player, who had admitted a gambling problem, MUST NOT be reopened, unless the player agrees or unless the player had asked for a temporary account lock only!!!

By the way, Rembrandt Casino offers casino games from Microgaming. And all Microgaming casinos shut down accounts for at least 6 MONTHS (with no exceptions!), when a gambling problem has been mentioned.

Marko

marko Germany
posted on November 22, 2013.

Regarding my proofs: Rembrandt Casino is NOT arguing that I sent an email on September 6th admitting my gambling problem. It is also NOT arguing the chat from November 8th, in which Henry confirmed that they have read my email from September 6th. Instead, the casino believes that it was legitimate to reopen my account 30 days later, because I had not mentioned a specific time frame for my account to be closed. That is, what this issue is all about!

In my email from September 6th I requested a closure of my account due to a gambling problem. I was not willing to think about a specific time frame. And I truly believe that I do not need to mention such a time frame. Imagine you go to a bank and ask for the closure of your bank account: You will not tell the bank the number of days or weeks, during which your account shall be closed. You just want your account to be closed. AND NO BANK WILL AUTOMATICALLY REOPEN YOUR BANK ACCOUNT 30 DAYS THEREAFTER WITHOUT YOUR CONSENT!!! As a matter of fact, the bank would require you to register again, and to agree to all terms and conditions again.

It is so obvious, that I just cannot understand how this casino is dealing with this serious issue. I still believe that a casino, who doesn't understand how responsible gaming works, should not hold a casino license. But now I wish to emphasize, that this is just my personal view, so that I do not hurt anyone.

marko

marko Germany
posted on November 22, 2013.

One more remark regarding my proofs: The chat from November 8th was much too long to save it in a single screenshot with the casino logo on it. I do have the complete chat as a WORD file. But, as I said in my previous post, the casino is not arguing that this chat took place.

I also have a copy of my email from September 6th in the "sent" folder of my email account. I do not want to post it here, because it contains my full name and my email address. I would like to stay anonymous with my gambling problem. Again, the casino is not arguing that I sent this email. They had indeed closed my account for 30 days, after having received my email.

But the casino does have a different opinion regarding the question, whether I need to specify a time frame when requesting an account lock due to a gambling problem. That is what needs to be discussed here: DOES A PLAYER NEED TO SPECIFY A TIME FRAME, WHEN HE REQUESTS AN ACCOUNT LOCK DUE TO A GAMBLING PROBLEM???

marko

posted on November 25, 2013.

Dear Marko,

We immediately stepped up on your request, one day after your registartion; you received clear communications how we handled your request; there was no respons / reaction your side towards this, there was no indication your side we did you wrong.

But we feel our commincation to you was clear...

marko Germany
posted on November 26, 2013.

Rembrandt Casino,

I do show respect and calm down with my language, but you don't seem to understand what responsible gaming is about. I promised on November 21st that I give you another 7 days to refund my deposits. So you have another 2 days to do so. I will keep my promise.

Responsible Gaming is as simple as this: A player, who requests his account to be closed due to a gambling problem, wants his account to be closed. If he does not mention that he wants a temporary account lock only, then he does not want a temporary account lock!!! I could have asked for a temporary account lock, if I wanted that. But I did not!

I have discussed this issue with my therapist and with some casino affiliates. They all say, that you MUST NOT reopen my account without my consent. You should have asked me whether I want my account to be reopened, before you reopened it. And you MUST NOT reopen my account, just because I do not reply to any of your emails.

Can you imagine, how difficult it is to overcome a gambling problem? A problem gambler does not want to communicate about the closure of his account. The email which I sent ("Please close my account. I have a gambling problem.") certainly is sufficient.

Please refund my deposits in the next 2 days. My therapist advises me to make use of a whole bunch of options, if you don't.

marko

AskGamblers
posted on November 27, 2013.

We would like to remind that Marko did not provide us with any proof of when and how he had asked for an account closure, due to gambling problems?! Without such proof our hands are tied and we cannot offer a final solution of this issue.

marko Germany
posted on November 29, 2013.

Now all the proof is on the table:

1) On September 6th I had requested an account closure due to a gambling problem.

2) The casino had received my email and closed my account upon my request.

3) The casino reopened my account 30 days later without my consent.

4) The chat file proves that the casino was aware of my gambling problem.

I ask for the refund of 3500 Euro which I deposited since September 6th.

marko6

marko Germany
posted on November 30, 2013.

How can I quit gambling, if Rembrandt Casino reopens my account WITHOUT my consent???

marko

marko Germany
posted on November 30, 2013.

How can any addicted player quit gambling, when a casino reopens his account WITHOUT his consent?

marko